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Discussion Starter #1
I know there are benefits to each, and some threads have touched on this subject already, but I'd like to know overall what you guys think is the easiest setup to tune for the street (including elevation changes of thousands of feet) and make good reliable power with minimal tweaking once the sweet spot is discovered. EFI, carb, blowthrough, drawthrough? If it matters, assume this will be mounted in the package tray somehow.
 

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I loved my draw thru where I used Aj'S customized 500 cfm 2 barrell with a dial-a-jet on it ---- no jets ever needed
ran pretty good with a 2165
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It's misleading when you say easiest. Easier is carb. Best is efi.

Efi you have precise control over all aspect of the tune at all times. Carb, not so much.... but the motor will run.

Price difference. . Carb 500 bucks. Efi 3k minimum
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Thanks Dean, I understand what you're saying, but can you quantify that?

Say for example, the result of less precise tuning with a carb is....well, pick one...1/4 mile ET, mpg/efficiency, horsepower, engine life, reliability, etc. What percentage of performance are you generally giving up for that $2500 savings and ease of tuning? A tenth in the 1/4 mile, 5% lower horsepower? I guess what I'm asking is if someone were to step outside of the drag race mentality where every tenth counts, and a fraction of a hp matters, how much of a difference does it really make? (in very general terms...average 2 liter with average tuner messing with it in the garage at home...)

I hope I'm not asking something that's not possible to answer!
 

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It's misleading when you say easiest. Easier is carb. Best is efi.

Efi you have precise control over all aspect of the tune at all times. Carb, not so much.... but the motor will run.

Price difference. . Carb 500 bucks. Efi 3k minimum
I agree with everything except cost. Megasquirt can be done quite cheap, much less than 3K
 

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I like efi, I enjoy tuning via laptop, seeing immediate results from the tuning on datalogs. Data is one of the biggest advantages to EFI, lots of racers spend big bucks on dataloggers to record what's happening with their setup, and based on that info they make a jet change, hoping to get a little closer to their target, but compromising another aspect of the tune.efi allows for no compromise, and comes with that expensive datalogger for free!
 

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my 3k includes the ecm, more fuel line (return), different pump, fuel fittings, extra fuel filters, coils, wiring, relays, sensors, intake track (however you design yours), flanges, clamps, throttle body (s), etc. etc etc.. it ALL adds up. i have spent enough money on having stuff tig'd for me i could of purchased a nice synchwave complete. i have seriously spent thousands on having someone weld for me.

i personally think that the efi setup is less stress on the motor overall for one, two, you have control over whole curve with fuel and timing. its not about tenths its about making or allowing your motor to run more efficiently which equates to HP; thats the benifit.

so, if money is no concern then efi. if money is a concern an ability to find someone to help you tune whatever system you choose then draw through. either way you will have fun.

going efi is a big step as for most of us its something completely new. its a lot of work, lot of planning and a lot of learning. im still learning... and have a looong way to go.

my thought would be to get the car running the least challenging way. buy a carb and run it for a while. while its running gather your stufff for efi. htat way your car is not sitting for another year or two. your out enjoying it.
 

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Thanks Dean, I understand what you're saying, but can you quantify that?

Say for example, the result of less precise tuning with a carb is....well, pick one...1/4 mile ET, mpg/efficiency, horsepower, engine life, reliability, etc. What percentage of performance are you generally giving up for that $2500 savings and ease of tuning? A tenth in the 1/4 mile, 5% lower horsepower? I guess what I'm asking is if someone were to step outside of the drag race mentality where every tenth counts, and a fraction of a hp matters, how much of a difference does it really make? (in very general terms...average 2 liter with average tuner messing with it in the garage at home...)

I hope I'm not asking something that's not possible to answer!
If your running an O2 sensor the EFI will adjust the AF/R to your settings.
 

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You can get a literal bolt-on kit for $3500 that has absolutely everything:

7071 Magna-Fuel & Spark Electronic Fuel Injection System - Turbo

Piece it together instead using MegaSquirt and ebay for things like injectors, etc, and you're well below $3000. Also consider this is a complete kit so you loose some cost anyway from parts that would be bought anyway whether you go carb or efi (Turbo, exhuast, wastegate, fuel system to a point, etc)

If you don't mind piecing it together and coming up with some stuff on your own, you can really do it for much less. CB end manifolds with injectors, single throttle body, etc. It can be done quite easily.

Starting from scratch, EFI isn't that far away from doing a complete carbureted system (new for new) these days. A lot of people would be suprised how much money you can save with a bit of elbow grease and creativity.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Thanks all. I had always thought that I should go with EFI when/if I make the jump to turbo, but a few posts here about how easy it is to throw a system together with a carb had me second guessing that idea. Back when I had $$$, I bought a "complete" setup with Haltech ECU, exhaust, intakes (now Eric's!), turbo, injectors, coils, wastegate, throttle body, etc....pretty much the whole ball of wax. I'm thinking that with what I have already sitting in boxes in my garage, maybe EFI is within reach. I'm not going to use everything that I have because I want it configured differently....but I should hold on to some of it I guess. I'm counting down the months to no more alimony payments (18)...and starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel!! I had to take control systems as one of my engineering classes, and I'm pretty good with manipulating spreadsheets, so I may be a bit rusty at it, but hopefully, I can make an EFI system work well enough to get me down the road.
 

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intakes (now Eric's!),:)

Ha, forgot about that. I'll be at Sac if that helps

I just look at is as if you dumb it down.

Bolt-on, $3500 for a CB setup that tunes itself while you drive. Tough to beat to be honest.

What for a carb turbo kit with fuel system and all, built to the same level as what you planned with a turbo setup? You add maybe 15% onto the fuel system cost. The pump and regulator is slightly more, and you have another 12 feet of fuel line. MS ECU and wiring harness along with injectors could be had for well under $1000.

You can do a carb turbo setup real cheap if you source everything used or on sale, but same with EFI. And vice-versa, you could do a carb setup with money thrown at it if you go all new and hi-po parts, same as EFI. The overall difference, same for same, in my opinion anyway, is not huge. But EFI will be more (mental) work on your part. Much more to learn. Unless you go CB, the new stuff is pretty much plug and play from what I understand.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Good points, thanks! I think I understand the fundamentals of EFI...I'm not going to try to learn any more in great detail until I pick a specific system and can actually get my "hands dirty" playing with it. It still comes down to providing spark and fuel with a lot of bells and whistles thrown in to tell it "how much", and "when" at any given set of parameters....including compensation for boost. Plug and play would be nice, but not as much fun I think (and not as afffordable in any case).

I don't plan on being at Sac this weekend, but I am going to make every effort to make it to the Bonneville WOS this September, if you're going to be in CA any more this summer, let me know....if not, hopefully you're at Bonneville, or I can give them to someone for you there.
 

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everyone has their choice on systems. a lot of guys on here like the megasquirt, i like the aem, and if you got the coin you could go with motec. there are some i wouldnt mess with too though. just look for one that will datalog.. if it doesnt have datalog capabilities then dont mess with it..

you can get stand alone dataloggers, pay 350 plus sensors for aem unit that will log 100 channels at 100 hz.. you can pay thousands for a racepak setup and there are a few others too.

so, do you due diligence and look around. see who is close to you and what they use.

go to your local pick and pull or ??? and you can get a lot of things from there that will save you money. start looking at some v8 sights for used items too. a lot of what i have is used but works great.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
I have a Haltech and a MSII, both older units, so I'm not sure whether they datalog or not. I'd like to use what I have, but don't want to use anything that's too outdated...like Larry on the insurance commercial telling you to save time by not rewinding videos in your VCR! I'm still not sure if I'll start out NA for a year or two and then switch the top end over to turbocharged, or jump right into it from the get go. The biggest engine I've had so far is an 1835.
 

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If I ever get back to it, I will be running the CB "Quick Tune" set up.
 
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